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kguske
Site Admin



Joined: Jun 04, 2004
Posts: 6432

PostPosted: Thu Oct 23, 2008 10:03 pm Reply with quote

Read an interesting article in Information Week about the results of a survey of IT vendors which said that that IT vendors "aren't gung ho about Web 2.0." But how did the survey define "Web 2.0"? Remember the old saying "There are lies, d***ed lies, and statistics." (I guess they forgot political interviews, uh, ads, which come under the category of purposefully misleading).

Anyway, in the same issue, there is a brief piece entitled "The Lust Factor" in which Steve Goodman, CEO of network monitoring vendor Packettrap, writes:

Steve Goodman wrote:
Recently, a friend said that the mantra of his company is to "build products that people lust for." While at first it sounds a bit corny, when you apply that statement to your product analysis, design, and development process, it makes a lot of sense. Innovation isn't only the invention and development of technology--sometimes innovation is honing your current processes.


So now that 2.3.0 is out, it's time to kick around ideas for future releases. We have jestrella's Content Plus on tap to replace the old Content module for the next release (it's currently an addon as we didn't have time to fully test it), and a host of other minor improvements.

But I'd like to know for planning purposes: what are your "Lust Factors"?

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Guardian2003
Site Admin



Joined: Aug 28, 2003
Posts: 6799
Location: Ha Noi, Viet Nam

PostPosted: Fri Oct 24, 2008 1:47 am Reply with quote

Better theme handling, possibly using Smarty and possibly having the ability to edit the theme through a
Themes
GUI ala Worpress or utilise CSS for individual blocks so they can be hidden/shown/expanded/compressed.
A site admin might wish to have available a number of blocks but a user should have the final 'option' as to which 'blocks' of data they see.

Language support
Better language handling and complete seperation of markup from plain text (literals).
Auto detect users preferred language so we don't have the current situation where for example someone from Germany visits an English site and cannot read the text to register because the site has English as default (just an example).
- already working on this Smile

Permissions (Groups?)
More granular permissions - read/write/edit/delete
As an example, you might want to allow specific individuals to write news posts without having to wait for admin approval but not give them 'admin' status. Likewise you might want to give individuals 'edit/delete' functionality to 'Moderate' news items but not give them admin status (same could apply to news comments).

Subscriptions/Donations
Discussed elsewhere

Clean Links
Removal of links to duplicate or 'substantially similar content'.
For example the news 'readmore', 'comment', and 'rate' links.
Why not have all that data available on one page and use something like AJAX to add a comment or 'rating' instead of one link for the news item, another link for the news item and comments, another link for the news item and user ratings.

Social Networking
Users should have the ability to specify which social networking sites they belong to so links to 'add' content to those sites can be dynamically generated within aproppriate content pages i.e. News, Content, Forum posts...

Tagging
I would love to see the ability to 'tag' news articles or content pages, forum posts etc with keywords. Possible have an auto generated list of the 5 most frequently used words in that data set, with the ability to edit from them (add/delete) and also manually 'prioritise' the order in which they appear and even create tag 'words' which when clicked, link to a specific url or a search results page (ala Swiki).
 
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Susann
Moderator



Joined: Dec 19, 2004
Posts: 3191
Location: Germany:Moderator German NukeSentinel Support

PostPosted: Fri Oct 24, 2008 8:02 am Reply with quote

A enhanced downloads module wich is able to show last updates of a download file or implentation of NSN GR downloads enhanced with several new features.

A Link to us module.

I quite agree with Guardian with the better language support and handling.
Multilingual keywords , multilingual blocks etc. would be just better.

Within the forums module integration of a report mod.

Beneed this a new version of the site info block with more options.


Last edited by Susann on Fri Oct 24, 2008 8:06 am; edited 1 time in total 
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jestrella
Moderator



Joined: Dec 01, 2005
Posts: 593
Location: Santiago, Dominican Republic

PostPosted: Fri Oct 24, 2008 8:05 am Reply with quote

Icon theme system
I'd love a icon theme system (just like themes), so we can have a more integrated design as right now all modules, blocks, etc. use their own graphics giving the idea IMHO of a non graphically integrated system.

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Guardian2003







PostPosted: Fri Oct 24, 2008 8:47 am Reply with quote

Susann multi-lingual keywords - good idea, I had forgotten about that!

We could definitely use something like NSN GR Downloads, in fact I used it for a while but reverted to the standard module for ease of maintenance.

jestrella nice idea but not sure how that would work as there is no way to know in advance the paths used for specific images in each module, block etc. It could be workable for 'core' blocks/modules and for the admin and RNYA screens though.
 
jestrella







PostPosted: Fri Oct 24, 2008 10:04 am Reply with quote

We could create a function/class to take charge of this. then we call like for example

icon('home');

The the function can check if the home icon is present in the current theme ad display it, if not then fallback to a standard generic icon. The class/function itself must set the path to the image (could be something like /icons/icon_theme/home.png).

Thoughts???
 
Guardian2003







PostPosted: Fri Oct 24, 2008 11:23 am Reply with quote

Sounds do-able but that of course is assuming we keep the way themes work currently. If there was a consensus to move to something else like Smarty or just make the theme integration work better from an SEO perspective (that is to say not doing silly things like it does as present by pulling right blocks in the footer code etc) then it could certainly be something to consider for the overall theme handling so it is part of the core system.
A good idea!
 
CodyG
Life Cycles Becoming CPU Cycles



Joined: Jan 02, 2003
Posts: 714
Location: Vancouver Island

PostPosted: Fri Oct 24, 2008 11:23 am Reply with quote

I love this topic! The L factor. lol


My Lust List:

Yes ... Granular Groups... on multiple levels. If you own the content, or you are in a group of owners, it you can edit it. And, assign admin'ing for groups, without giving all the keys to anyone who wants to manage a group.

Yes ... Icon Manager! I wanted one of those back in days of nuke 6, but no one was listening. Smile

Also... How To Mod Manual. (An update of karakas php-nuke manual would rock.)

The new YA module is light years ahead of the old, but... my wish list includes a few more features.... Profile Image, Content Account (what forums, what galleries, what PM, what News, what Pages, what links, what addons, if any) Links to skype, facebook. On the admin side ... a throwaway registration field type, required for registration only, iow, some registration data deleted after approval.

Some Image Gallery Options a plug and play for flicker, picasa, i don't even know all the image storage places, but it seems like a good idea that user gallery content is stored elsewhere. But how would you integrate for multi-user interaction into a module or block? ie: block_latestgalleries.php?? Perhaps this is linked to more social networking.

Way more css theming.

Old Mod Support. I'm an old mod, I fell down and I can't get up.
IM, Friendfinder, ZClassifed, others may have others.

And on the other side of the wish list coin ... What I don't want to see ... too much uncommented oop.

ROTFL lust lists are fun!

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kguske







PostPosted: Fri Oct 24, 2008 12:49 pm Reply with quote

Profile image = custom field of type image / upload field (Hmmm...)

Content account ? Not sure what you meant by this

Links to skype, facebook = custom field of type link with id (Hmmm...)

Throwaway registration field type = required for registration, but private (i.e. would still be there, but only visible to admin)
 
fkelly
Former Moderator in Good Standing



Joined: Aug 30, 2005
Posts: 3312
Location: near Albany NY

PostPosted: Fri Oct 24, 2008 2:00 pm Reply with quote

A Paypal module or a decision to use zencart or something similar (sounds like we've decided on the module approach).

Continued improvement in the mailer including the ability to validate and process text file lists right through the HTML newsletter. Also to process emails in "batches" to work better with servers and avoid job size limitations.

Modular build of the distribution so you can pick the modules, themes, and languages you want to support and not have to load 7 gadzillion files for those you don't ever intend to use. Take a look at how Gallery does this: you can install a base set and then go into maintenance mode and load "add-ons" one at a time.

A better interface to nsngroups (along the lines of RNYA?) and maybe integration with RNYA and a standard approach to using groups to control privileges. While the "old" admin interface for RN probably can not be phased out in one release, there is no reason a groups approach could not work in conjunction with it.

Move to PHPBB3 and stop support for PHPBB2. Way LESS integration ... just have a users bridge and that's it. Use the native PHPBB3 code ... including their templates instead of our themes. Eliminate thousands of duplicative files that are currently in our /themes/forums and includes directories. Since we would be using native PHPBB code we could rely on them for support rather than an overtaxed RN staff. And yeah I know there would be a lot of whining ... so what.


Last edited by fkelly on Fri Oct 24, 2008 2:40 pm; edited 1 time in total 
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kguske







PostPosted: Fri Oct 24, 2008 2:23 pm Reply with quote

Frank, please don't beat around the bush - tell us what you really think! <sarcasm> Smile
 
fkelly







PostPosted: Fri Oct 24, 2008 3:23 pm Reply with quote

Kevin, oh man, can't you just tell that the whole approach to PHPBB has been bugging me for years? You (meaning the PHPnuke folks originally) take a product that is larger and more sophisticated than the whole of Nuke and try to INTEGRATE it? The tail is wagging the dog there. Interface perhaps but integrate? The same I think is true for Gallery ... another huge and sophisticated product where there is a lame integration approach that is not really supported in any consistent way. Slide show works in native Gallery but not when run in embedded mode. You are out of luck because you will get no support from the one person who does the integration ... in his spare time and whenever he can and for free. Why not have a user bridge back and forth that would not require modification to the core code of either system, same as with PHPBB?
 
Raven
Site Admin/Owner



Joined: Aug 27, 2002
Posts: 17088

PostPosted: Fri Oct 24, 2008 4:59 pm Reply with quote

This is all great stuff, for sure Wink - Now to (maybe) rain on the parade killing me

"Let's do the time warp again!" - Okay, be honest - What movie is that line from and no looking it up; that's cheating!! -- Answer

My point? We are reliving my Nirvana (with updates of course Wink )

Let's play "Who/What Am I?" or even better "Who/What Am I To Be?"

Content Management System aka CMS
    * A system used to manage the content of a Web site. Typically, a CMS consists of two elements: the content management application (CMA) and the content delivery application (CDA). The CMA element allows the content manager or author, who may not know Hypertext Markup Language (HTML), to manage the creation, modification, and removal of content.

    * A computer application used to create, edit, manage, and publish content in a consistently organized fashion.[1] CMSs are frequently used for storing, controlling, versioning, and publishing industry-specific documentation such as news articles, operators' manuals, technical manuals, sales guides, and marketing brochures. The content managed may include computer files, image media, audio files, video files, electronic documents, and Web content.

    * A CMS may support the following features:
      + identification of all key users and their content management roles;
      + the ability to assign roles and responsibilities to different content categories or types;
      + definition of workflow tasks for collaborative creation, often coupled with event messaging so that content managers are alerted to changes in content (For example, a content creator submits a story, which is published only after the copy editor revises it and the editor-in-chief approves it.);
      + the ability to track and manage multiple versions of a single instance of content;
      + the ability to capture content (e.g. scanning);
      + the ability to publish the content to a repository to support access to the content (Increasingly, the repository is an inherent part of the system, and incorporates enterprise search and retrieval.);
      + separation of content's semantic layer from its layout (For example, the CMS may automatically set the color, fonts, or emphasis of text.).

    * Allows publishing of new content to web sites. These systems eliminate the need for content writers to be concerned with the technical details. And while at first glance, content publishing might not seem like it should be difficult, more detailed examination reveals some of the complexity. First, consider that content comes in many forms:
      + articles and white papers
      + press release and company news
      + pictures
      + products information
      + frequently asked questions/answers
      + email archives and newsgroups
      + Flash presentations and online demos
      + streaming audio and video

    * With all these different types of content, there is a need for systems to first create (author) the content, then describe it (metadata tagging), and eventually update it. On top of these basic tasks, the system should also:
      + let several people collaborate and edit content together
      + provide workflow to let the right people do the right things at the right time
      + have security measures to stop the wrong people from manipulating the content
      + keep track of changes to the content through the use of versioning
      + provide scheduling to control when content is displayed
      + use templates to publish the content in a standard format so that a certain look and feel is maintained across the site
      + personalize the content so user's can customize the viewing experience


Portal
    * A do-all, mega Web site or service providing search engines, e-mail, chat rooms, forums, shopping malls, etc. Examples: Yahoo, AltaVista, etc.

    * A starting point for people surfing the internet. It functions like a gateway, providing links to various sorts of websites across different interests and needs. A very popular web portal is Yahoo!

    * Provides a single function via a web page or site. Web portals often function as a point of access to information on the World Wide Web. Portals present information from diverse sources in a unified way. Apart from the search engine standard, web portals offer other services such as e-mail, news, stock prices, infotainment, and other features. Portals provide a way for enterprises to provide a consistent look and feel with access control and procedures for multiple applications, which otherwise would have been different entities altogether. An example of a web portal is Yahoo!. Another descriptor for 'web portal' would be 'place of value, to visit, often'.

    * A web portal is a term, often used interchangeably with gateway, for a World Wide Web site whose purpose is to be a major starting point for users when they connect to the Web. There are general portals and specialized or niche portals. Some major general portals include Yahoo, CNET, AOL, and MSN. Examples of niche portals that are accessible to the public include Garden.com (for gardeners), Fool.com (for investors), and DPReview.com (for photographers). Private niche portals are those that are used by employees of a company. Companies such as IBM and MasterCard use portals to help disseminate information to their employees in a timely and efficient manner.
      + A number of large access providers offer portals to the Web for their own users. Most portals have adopted the Yahoo style of content categories with a light-weight, text-based page that loads quickly. Companies with portal sites have attracted much stock market investor interest because portals are viewed as able to command large audiences which in turn translates to a large number of advertising viewers.
      + Typical services offered by public portal sites include a directory of Web sites, a facility to search for other sites, news, weather information, e-mail, stock quotes, phone and map information, and sometimes a community forum. Private portals often include access to payroll information, internal phone directories, company news, and employee documentation.

speedtype
 
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kguske







PostPosted: Fri Oct 24, 2008 7:28 pm Reply with quote

How about a Content Management Portal (CMP)? Or a Portal Management System (PMS)?
 
fkelly







PostPosted: Fri Oct 24, 2008 9:02 pm Reply with quote

PMS would be a good acronym for sure. Or how about Web Information Management Portal?
 
Dawg
RavenNuke(tm) Development Team



Joined: Nov 07, 2003
Posts: 928

PostPosted: Fri Oct 24, 2008 10:43 pm Reply with quote

There are a couple things missing from the add on collection...

1. Classified Ads
2. Video Support (I have been working on this right steady)

There are MODS out there to do this stuff....How Secure they are and how well they work....that is another issue.

I love the bridge idea.

I would also LOVE to see us all DUMP Nuke and go it alone with Ravens direction.

Just my .0000002 cents.

Dawg
 
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montego
Site Admin



Joined: Aug 29, 2004
Posts: 9457
Location: Arizona

PostPosted: Sat Oct 25, 2008 2:04 pm Reply with quote

fkelly wrote:
PMS would be a good acronym for sure. Or how about Web Information Management Portal?


WIMP! You crack me up fkelly!

killing me

What could I possibly add to all of this except that I'd love to see a spreadsheet with a collection of key features down the left-hand column and competing systems across the top. Then, some type of rating of each system by feature or just a check-mark.

Hey, why not find out what the other guys are doing and then figure out how to do it better? Wink

I know, I know, I know... we're just a small team of very part-time volunteers. Tough to do too much. But, nothing wrong with a defined roadmap.

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HTML Newsletter::ShortLinks::Mailer::Downloads and more... 
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spasticdonkey
RavenNuke(tm) Development Team



Joined: Dec 02, 2006
Posts: 1693
Location: Texas, USA

PostPosted: Sat Oct 25, 2008 2:30 pm Reply with quote

I'd like to see the ability to use a different default theme depending on whether the user is registered or not... A nice lightweight SEO friendly theme for search engines and unregistered users, and a more dynamic, higher bandwidth consuming theme with more features, for registered users.

Also the ability for users to customize which blocks they see (maybe expand/collapse), and possibly where they appear, and have the site remember those settings for next time.

How about news stories being displayed in something like the "featured content slider" from dynamic drive? [ Only registered users can see links on this board! Get registered or login! ]

more default bbcode features for the forums would be cool. Been using "advanced bbcode box" for some time... users enjoy being able to post youtube and google videos directly on the boards, as well as other features.


Last edited by spasticdonkey on Sat Oct 25, 2008 2:42 pm; edited 1 time in total 
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kguske







PostPosted: Sat Oct 25, 2008 2:41 pm Reply with quote

Montego, I don't have a spreadsheet (yet), but I definitely have ideas and plans, and I'm already comparing other systems functions and addons. There is an interesting, but simple (and commercial) plugin for Joomla that shows a member's flickr photos on their profile...that should be easy enough to do with flickr, Picasa, and others (I'm reviewing the gamut of photo sharing services to see what the possibilities are, and have a spreadsheet for that!). It's something simple that someone requested (Cody?), but the benefits could be linked to Guardian's gallery idea...

Spasticdonkey, I have the featuredcontentslider on nukeseo, but it's a very basic implementation. I was thinking of something better, and integrated with jquery, for the future. Smile
 
Guardian2003







PostPosted: Sat Oct 25, 2008 3:17 pm Reply with quote

spasticdonkey wrote:
I'd like to see the ability to use a different default theme depending on whether the user is registered or not...

We can do that already. None registered see the 'default' theme whilst registered users see whatever is available.
But to expand on what I think you might have been hinting at...
Have a really basic text and CSS only theme for presenting content to search engines whilst none 'bots' get something a little prettier - that would be radical!

Quote:
A nice lightweight SEO friendly theme for search engines...

The way themes are handled at the moment prevents good SEO in as much as the 'meat' of the content should be higher up in the code. It is certainly something we are looking at already but how far it is possible to take it without completely destroying backward compatibility with none RN themes is another problem (or not depending on your point of view).
Quote:

Also the ability for users to customize which blocks they see (maybe expand/collapse), and possibly where they appear, and have the site remember those settings for next time.
I would like to see that too, possibly use a DIV id container for each block....

Quote:

How about news stories being displayed in something like the "featured content slider" from dynamic drive......

Would love to see some form of 'featured content' presented like that.
My only caveat would be that the container for the content would have to be a fixed size, I find it a little disconcerting when the different size of the 'featured content' cause everything on the page under it to jiggle up and down.

Quote:
more default bbcode features for the forums would be cool...

Personally, I don't like them. Wastes resources for tons of stuff that might not get used - depending on the site.
However, it would be really cool to be able to switch between a 'basic' bbcode box and an 'advanced' bbcode box as I think that would satisfy more users.
I know there are some excellent BBCode to HTML and HTML to BBCode (Classes) converters out there, so it might even be better to use something like that, possibly, maybe..

Some excellent suggestions, thank you very much for your input!
 
Guardian2003







PostPosted: Sat Oct 25, 2008 3:20 pm Reply with quote

Whilst we are mentioning BBCode etc I would really love to see Geshi built in.
 
Dawg







PostPosted: Sat Oct 25, 2008 4:20 pm Reply with quote

Guardian2003 wrote:
spasticdonkey wrote:
I'd like to see the ability to use a different default theme depending on whether the user is registered or not...

We can do that already. None registered see the 'default' theme whilst registered users see whatever is available.
But to expand on what I think you might have been hinting at...
Have a really basic text and CSS only theme for presenting content to search engines whilst none 'bots' get something a little prettier - that would be radical!


Guardian, I do this to some extent already using NavTap as the "Kicker" IF you are unregistered you get X and if youa re registered you get Y. It is pretty easy to do. My setup has the Dynamic Titles at the start and finish of the pages with a few "This and That" in between to make the SEs happy.

Dawg
 
spasticdonkey







PostPosted: Sat Oct 25, 2008 5:56 pm Reply with quote

yes i understand that registered users can pick which ever theme they prefer, but I noticed in the SQL tables you will find 98% of the users use the "default" theme. Everyone here knows how to change themes as a user, but many users not familiar with nuke don't even know about changing themes.

I'm basically referring to having 2 default themes, one for registered and another for everyone else. Implementing this would be pretty simple... I already did something similar on one of my sites, serving up a different header depending on registered status.

---------

As far as a content slider, yes you would need to find a way to truncate news stories to fit within a fixed size DIV, unless the DIV could somehow be "scrollable" or "expandable". The featuredcontentslider I mentioned is nice because even though it uses javascript, the content pages are all nested in DIV's and are still pretty SEO friendly.. Smile

---------

as far as advanced bbcode, the version I use from clan themes only changes the post reply page and the "quick reply" remains untouched, so in essence those who don't want to use it don't have to. If your site is about coding/programming, yes advanced bbcode isnt really needed, but if your site is about something else you could say the same about geshi Smile

---------

there are also alot of cool modules out there that could be added to the "AddOnFiles"

some of my favorites:
*nukeSEO sitemap
*slaytanic's Dynamic Keywords
*nukecoder's Doc's module

----------

Building on the tags system in Content Plus would be cool. Maybe make it work, (and easy to implement) for multiple modules so when browsing tags you get results from all over the site...?

----------

oh, and since we lusting over things, how about someone reviving MS-analysis... It sure has some cool features, top modules, users, os, referrers, countries of the day, etc, displayed in a block... Last seen members with country flags, and so on.... ms-topsites was cool too, I even have a shortlinks tap all ready for that (that took awhile) Smile
 
kguske







PostPosted: Sat Oct 25, 2008 8:33 pm Reply with quote

Sitemap is on my list, as well as dynamic meta (title, keywords, descriptions). I developed a proof of concept that dynamically generated keywords (and, presumably, tags) based on specific content, and have the design to be able to override keywords, title, description for any content / URL. But, with RNYA in the works, I didn't have time to complete it.

I am also interested in MS Analysis and much improved search (Sitemap is similar to mSearch, and both can be rewritten to be much better).

How similar is nukecoder's Docs module to the Legal module? Or is it a specialized type of paginated content, similar to Tutoriaux?
 
spasticdonkey







PostPosted: Sat Oct 25, 2008 9:31 pm Reply with quote

nukecoder.com wrote:
Nuke Docs v1 beta for RavenNuke(tm)
Nuke Docs is a module designed to make writing structured documentation as easy as possible.
Pages are arranged in a hierarchal fashion with the ability to have unlimited chapers and sub-chapters.
Administration is done completely from within the module so pages can be added, edited, de-activated, or deleted on the fly.


It uses the FCKeditor so if you logged in as admin it appears within the module, making it easy to add pages or new docs. Also got a few things figured out so it works with dynamic titles, nukeFEED, nukeSEO sitemap, and also uses rewrites to put the document title in the URL (one of the most important seo tricks in my opinion Smile )
those things are shared here:
http://nukecoder.com/ftopict-543-Nuke_Docs_v1_beta_for_RavenNuke.html

Image

module download: http://nukecoder.com/shop_item-12.html

oh and glad to hear there is another ms-analysis fan out there
Smile
we should clone you guys so you would have time to adopt it Smile
 
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