To fork or not to fork - that is the question

Site Admin/Owner Joined: Aug 27, 2002 Posts: 17088

Chris,

Rats! Tried to go from memory. Oh well, I tried Embarassed

I will check those links out as soon as I can. Thanks.

New Member Joined: Mar 08, 2004 Posts: 9

Quote:

Why? Today, we have to answer questions like

I want the left column to disappear.

I want the right column to disappear.

I want to set the foreground/background/table/whatever colour in my theme.

I want the list item character to be a bullet/ring/nuke symbol/whatever.

I want only 3 news to be displayed in the home page, not 5, 10, 15 or 20. .........

Not wanting to sound like I'm plugging my own project, but NSN-Nuke does these and more Wink

[edit]
True, it still requires a setting in the files, but putting a setting in the database would be good too Smile

Thanks

[/edit]

AI

Worker Joined: Feb 16, 2004 Posts: 164

Hey ArtificialIntel, do you guys have a shopping cart organised for NSN Nuke? I could be tempted to change....im playing with oscnukelite at the moment....what of using nuke modules - are they easy to port.........its been a while since i set up a NSN test site - when your early beta releases were out - i tried .......im afraid i got a little impatient....so i tried everything else under the sun.

Posted: Mon Mar 08, 2004 3:01 pm

Id love to participate too - since ill be learning so much from you guys in terms of coding PHP - id be all to happy to do documentation - im great at install guides and stuff ill share the load with you Reikimaster!

I see this project as a wonderful opportunity to learn! - and since im around all the time anyway you may as well put me to work! Mr. Green

Apprentice No.1

P.S You need to rework the forums give us all categories - I guess id come under Apprentice!

Posted: Mon Mar 08, 2004 3:53 pm

Hmmmm. Yes I agree with one of the posts above. You and Chatserv have helped me out immensly (I'm Gunner on Chatserv's site) and I can appreciate the patience both of you have for noobs... in addition to your high level coding ability.

I decided long ago to go with NC 6.5 bundle, why, b/c I was hoping it would break away from the regular realeases of phpnuke and people like you and Chatserv would make it great. Well that never happened and I couldn't understand why. Afterall, most people give FB credit for the original idea, but then slag him for bad code production, secrecy, and failure to support the project. I thought for sure that given "permission" to develope a fork, NC would have run with it. So if you decide to break away, I would be worried that sometime down the road development would stop and a path back to a current portal would be umpossible.

Worker Joined: Aug 28, 2003 Posts: 227

I've been starting at this input box for 5 minutes trying to collect my thoughts on this topic. I'm not good at this so bear with me. Smile

What it boils down to is confusion. Confusion on who is developing for this system for the official package (nukecops or phpnuke.org?), who's integrating and blessing the patches for the security problems (and where do I get that new version of the core), who the heck are people like nukescripts that seem to have a replacement for php-nuke (but also add-ons) where do you provide input for features (like a WYSIWYG editor or a menu program) etc. etc.

With these new announcements at phpnuke.org I'm even more confused.
Too many cooks in the fire? This system is so great for so many organizations. But to me it's lacking basic functions - like a calendar. The one I use is great - adminstrative approved entries. But that author has fallen off the planet. WHy isn't something simple like that added?

I'm for trying to do a fork. I voted for 7.1 but you guys know the guts of 6.9 or 7.1 more than I do.

thanks

Posted: Mon Mar 08, 2004 5:15 pm

as much as it pains me to say it, I don't think PHP-Nuke is going to be immensly different in terms of features from NSN-Nuke as FB seems to be erm..... "borrowing" most of our ideas for his own project.

If worst did come to the worst and a fork were to go out the window after a while of being in production, I don't see it happening without some form of converter to go to another system, whether it be NSN, PHP or some other form of Nuke that's out there. I know that if something did happen to NSN-Nuke (which there's not even the slightest chance of at this current moment in time) I'd certainly do a converter.

Not sure which CMS / Portal I'd convert to yet though Wink

(though I've been keeping an eye on e107 for a while and it still looks good)

AI

Posted: Mon Mar 08, 2004 5:21 pm

paranor wrote:

What it boils down to is confusion. Confusion on who is developing for this system for the official package (nukecops or phpnuke.org?), who's integrating and blessing the patches for the security problems (and where do I get that new version of the core), who the heck are people like nukescripts that seem to have a replacement for php-nuke (but also add-ons) where do you provide input for features (like a WYSIWYG editor or a menu program) etc. etc.

ok. even though I've been out of the PHP-Nuke community for a while now, I'll make it simple.

phpnuke.org is the home of FB. The only "creator" of PHP-Nuke who occationally visits to do more than post the huge numbers of News articles that appear there.

NukeCops is his main support site who also create a few modifications as well as "PHP-Nuke Plus!" type packages for people to download. This site is also the place where any security updates appear (though there are many sources outside NukeCops that these originate at as well as the odd one from NukeCops themselves)

NukeScripts is run by BobMarion who has produced many excellant scripts in the past like the NSN-Your_Account module which has many more features in than the standard PHP-Nuke one has (had? I've not seen it in PHP-Nuke since 6.8 )

NSN-Nuke is run by myself, Viper & BobMarion and is a completely different CMS / Portal project which started off as a fork from PHP-Nuke 6.7 though has changed and developed heavily since then (including the stripping out of all the languages except english until such time as translations are available again - I think there's a couple now, but not sure which)

That any clearer?

AI

Posted: Mon Mar 08, 2004 5:35 pm

Yes, the history helps. But again, what is the difference between what Bob is doing on NSN-Nuke versus NukeScripts? Is NSN-Nuke from scratch type of approach and Bob is helping out? If so then why is Bob spending time/energy on Nukescripts?

Smile

Posted: Mon Mar 08, 2004 6:10 pm

Paranor, you should try Event Calendar 2.12 - its the best calendar module out there with full event submission, admin verification and allocation to user / admin control.

And it works with phpnuke 7.0 (im using it) although it was not designed for it. It may need some security updates though - What you think Raven?
I noticed you posted a bug fix for the 2.12, do you think it could be improved?

Tis good Very Happy

Posted: Mon Mar 08, 2004 6:16 pm

Rikk03 - that is what I'm using and you are right - it is awesome. Smile

I think this thread is getting hijacked. Sorry!

Posted: Mon Mar 08, 2004 6:27 pm

It sounds to me that Raven, - you plan something radically different in terms of design, being able to snap modules in or out, switch them on or off. Will such conversion be that simple?

Posted: Mon Mar 08, 2004 6:47 pm

Don't modules snap in and out now?

Worker Joined: Aug 16, 2003 Posts: 107 Location: USA

ArtificialIntel nice to see you here, excelent work on nsn nuke once you get a gallery it i will be happy.

Raven & Chatserv would you guy consider working on nsn nuke. Having great programer on the same project will go faster.

Posted: Mon Mar 08, 2004 7:40 pm

Quote:

I thought for sure that given "permission" to develope a fork, NC would have run with it. So if you decide to break away, I would be worried that sometime down the road development would stop and a path back to a current portal would be umpossible.

This is my worry with NC as well as I've tried to express on their forum but never get an answer. The slightest criticism about NC or nuke and you get treated as though you have exposed yourself in public.

Simply put: what if ZX decided he had had enough of computers and wanted to take up needlework? Everything has become concentrated at NC - we've lost FB's site forums, nukemods etc - and I think this is a big danger. It isn't easy to get help there anymore; if your post gets overlooked, go begging.

I switched to nukescripts modified release for a while but had a few problems and Bob was flat out with nsn-nuke so I switched back to Raven's V7 distro.

I have never used the NC CVS because it's almost impossible to find out how it works etc. I have the impression from trying to learn about it that if you are on a hosted server you can't use it - I maybe totally wrong on that but how do I find out? It must be extremely difficult for absolute newbies to phpNuke, PHP etc to get started.

I have only been using nuke for a couple of years and this breakdown of the community is a growing worry for me. I have the feeling sometimes that V7 will be my last upgrade (which is VERY loose term in the nuke community - with any other software all these releases would just be minor maintenance releases) because of this whole insecurity about the future of phpnuke.

I share your concern that if you choose the wrong fork path ( and they seem to be multiplying weekly) we are going to end up in limbo somewhere.

Ron....

Posted: Mon Mar 08, 2004 9:02 pm

It is true that we all have our idea of what will make a more perfect world, eg. nuke, portal/cms. Maybe an analogy might be that there are not only many brands/styles of cars, but within the same family (Chevy) there are many different cars/trucks. They all have the basic premise of transportation but you have low end and high end and much inbetween. So goes this thread. What I am envisioning is not quite what I see in some of the others. It doesn't mean they are right/wrong/same - it means they serve a purpose for a certain group of people. I guess that's about the jist of it. What Chris K. and I were discussing earlier is more of what I really have in mind. I am not in this for the ego trip. I'm to old a dog to worry about that at this stage. I would just like to see a system that has a core that everything else plugs into and has a standard API for doing things. I know there are those out there too, but they still require too much on/of the user. Oh well, I am waxing on and on. But, I envision a somewhat different version than what others have out there. I don't see it as being Raven's. I see it as being a core system that can become Lateron's, or Afc's, or Rikk's, etc. Seriously, I do. I believe it can be done with the right talent.

Posted: Mon Mar 08, 2004 9:14 pm

I think I see what you are getting at.

It would just be the core system and not necessarily contain any pre-done modules (like a calendar). Did I get that right?

You also mentioned that there are other sites that are core based with API's. What would those be?

Posted: Mon Mar 08, 2004 9:20 pm

gator wrote:

Hmmmm. Yes I agree with one of the posts above. You and Chatserv have helped me out immensly (I'm Gunner on Chatserv's site) and I can appreciate the patience both of you have for noobs... in addition to your high level coding ability.

I decided long ago to go with NC 6.5 bundle, why, b/c I was hoping it would break away from the regular realeases of phpnuke and people like you and Chatserv would make it great. Well that never happened and I couldn't understand why. Afterall, most people give FB credit for the original idea, but then slag him for bad code production, secrecy, and failure to support the project. I thought for sure that given "permission" to develope a fork, NC would have run with it. So if you decide to break away, I would be worried that sometime down the road development would stop and a path back to a current portal would be umpossible.

Just for the record, no one needs permission to 'fork'. You just do it. And, unfortunately, projects do die. The good thing is, is if the project had support and a support team, they usually survive. Only time will tell Smile

Posted: Mon Mar 08, 2004 11:55 pm

paranor wrote:

I think I see what you are getting at.

It would just be the core system and not necessarily contain any pre-done modules (like a calendar). Did I get that right?

You also mentioned that there are other sites that are core based with API's. What would those be?

Not the same as what I am wanting, but they would be Postnuke and Xayara, amongst others.

Hangin' Around Joined: Sep 10, 2002 Posts: 30

Interesting thread and I am glad to see the NSN Nuke boys participate in the thread.

Personally I would follow Raven's direction with some interest. I've come to see that GPL projects (well, PHP-Nuke really isn't GPL anymore) need a strong leadership and not one that is in it purely for their own self-gratification or wallet. I'll help where I can, but that's not much more than hassling Raven for additions to his fine script.

Show me the way Raven. I've got a new site I need to setup but I'm waiting for some direction as to what I install on it !!!! (no, it's ok, I'll go with 6.9 and wait until RaveNuke is ready for testing)

Posted: Tue Mar 09, 2004 12:07 am

You might want to try my customized distro or the 7.1 from here with the security fixes already applied.

registered · Regular Joined: Jun 30, 2003 Posts: 81

Wow this topic got way off track.. AI you can stop with the NSN sales pitch allready, everypost you make your tend to mention NSN. Can we please stick to the orignial topic. Fork away Raven, "RAISE THE ROOF, IN THE NUKE COMMUNITY" Life is too short to say.." d*** I should of fork it 5 years ago..." Cool

by then we will be on PHP-Nuke 24.1 and still getting red x's on guest avatars.. lol

Posted: Tue Mar 09, 2004 1:22 am

I may not have given this impression but I am interested in being a part of this and offering what help my limited knowledge will allow.

Posted: Tue Mar 09, 2004 1:29 am

Project Raven, RaveNuke (above) what were you thinking of calling this vision?

It needs a name guys.

Posted: Tue Mar 09, 2004 1:42 am

Best decide if the vision is going further. Then it's best to decide the name in secret, grab the domain names and then announce. Too many times a$$holes run and grab domains while projects are still in the "So what about some ideas for names" stage.

(note:RaveNuke.com was available when I made that post)