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selectric
Regular
Regular


Joined: Aug 06, 2008
Posts: 65

PostPosted: Wed Aug 27, 2008 6:16 pm Reply with quote

Hello and thank you for your time.

In RavenNuke, I have not found a file demanding that the "HowToInstall" folder remain intact, nor have I found a demand that the "distributed by... and New code by .... Team" footer links stay intact. (Especially confusing, as they are inserted into an optional footer box in the admin site settings).

What is the official RavenNuke stand on this?
PHP-Nuke allows for the removal of their name, which is rediculously priced, but required for those who need to build a site on PHP-Nuke, but their client doesnt want footer 3rd party links...

What about the Ravennuke ones? Since they are input into the admin optional footer box....

Thanks
 
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Gremmie
Former Moderator in Good Standing


Joined: Apr 06, 2006
Posts: 2415
Location: Iowa, USA

PostPosted: Wed Aug 27, 2008 8:23 pm Reply with quote

Edit: I had a bunch of stuff here, but I think I will retract it.

Please review the GPL here: Only registered users can see links on this board! Get registered or login!

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jakec
Site Admin


Joined: Feb 06, 2006
Posts: 3048
Location: United Kingdom

PostPosted: Thu Aug 28, 2008 12:25 am Reply with quote

If they don't want to give credit to the developers of the CMS and they are not willing to pay the going rate for a commercial license then perhaps they should look at a different CMS.

It's not just the credits in the footer, what about all the copyrights in the corner of the individual modules, do they want them removed as well?
 
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Susann
Moderator


Joined: Dec 19, 2004
Posts: 3191
Location: Germany:Moderator German NukeSentinel Support

PostPosted: Thu Aug 28, 2008 4:12 am Reply with quote

I personally don´t support sites with the removed footer links if they ask for help with something.
 
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Gremmie
PostPosted: Thu Aug 28, 2008 7:04 am Reply with quote

Okay, I can't resist. Embarassed

No one expects you to keep the HowToInstall or Installation folders after install. Removing those files and folders are perfectly fine. The software and its configuration are free for you to change however you want, and this includes deleting files and directories.

The footer text is stored in the database, it was meant to be changed. *I* would have some moral qualms about deleting it, but I believe you can legally do it. Francisco Burzi had no legal legs to stand on when he charged people to remove that text from PHP-Nuke, IMHO.

RavenNuke and PHP-Nuke are GPL software. The point of free software, as defined by the GPL, is that once you receive a GPL program, you have the freedom to do with it what you want, and you cannot deny others that same freedom. So if you want to remove that stuff you can. You can change the software all you want, you have that freedom!!! That is the point of the GPL. However, if you do decide to distribute your changed software, you are obligated to provide the source code so that others can do the same. You should also preserve any copyrights from code you built on in the source code.

It is a big no-no to remove people's copyrights from the code if you distribute a derivative work. I don't think the footer text falls in that category since it is stored in the database. The derived source code and docs are where you must preserve copyrights.

The GNU folks highly recommend that people creating GPL'ed software that is interactive or displays output to produce copyright info visually. PHP-Nuke does that via the footer. However I don't think the GPL forbids the end user from modifying that (although again, I'd have some moral problems with that).

I hope your client considers making a donation and crediting the team in another way if they do decide to remove it.

DISCLAIMER: I'm not a lawyer, nor am I speaking for Raven, or the RavenNuke team in this post. I may in fact be wrong about some or all of this. But I have spent a fair amount of time reading the GPL and have actually released several programs under it. I hope I understand it to some degree for that reason. Laughing
 
warren-the-ape
Worker
Worker


Joined: Nov 19, 2007
Posts: 196
Location: Netherlands

PostPosted: Thu Aug 28, 2008 12:27 pm Reply with quote

I always found the original footer credits in php-nuke with the fransisco burzi bla bla.. somewhat over the top.

Are we talking about the same credits displayed at the bottom of; Only registered users can see links on this board! Get registered or login!, cause i can understand its quite a mouthful especially if your site has a minimalistic style/design.

I dont run RN but php-nuke and altered my footer credits into;
© year website name - Powered by PHP-Nuke & phpBB

Less crap, more to the point Wink


But what I want to say with all this (and thats a personal opinion) is that if you have/want to remove it why not keep at least 1 simple link?
And perhaps even put the 'expanded credits' in as a comment within the html code.

@ Susann
I know that phpBB does the same Razz and can completely understand it.
 
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Susann
PostPosted: Thu Aug 28, 2008 3:04 pm Reply with quote

@selectric you should ask Raven directly via PN.
I´m quite sure you will hear many opinions and different answers here.
The story is not long ago many RavenNuke users asked how can we give back credit to the different Developer of this great CMS and so the HowTo/Install credit page was born.
Of course if you have already a credit module you can add there additional credits.
A RavenNuke ™ site is something special it stands for a secure product. You should be proud to have such a link in the footer.

I don ´t support such sites and I have my principles don´t know how other moderators handle this. I don´t care.
 
jestrella
Moderator


Joined: Dec 01, 2005
Posts: 593
Location: Santiago, Dominican Republic

PostPosted: Sun Aug 31, 2008 9:46 am Reply with quote

We can also create a link to a credits page and place all that copyright stuff into it, and this in any way violates the GNU/GPL license at all.

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